Andrew Stroehlein, European Media Director of the Human Rights Watch, was a guest on N1 live studio on Monday, where he talked about human rights violations in Russia in the midst of the country’s preparations for the 2018 World Cup, which begins on June 14.

What are your main concerns regarding human rights, especially in the context of the World Cup?

They fall into a few different categories. First, it is the workers’ rights. When they were building the stadiums and the infrastructure, in preparations for the World Cup, workers’ rights were not respected in many places. There were a lot of strikes, there were a lot of reports about people not being paid. At least 21 people died on these construction sites in different situations that were not very clear. That is one part, the workers’ rights.

Another part is what is happening in Chechnya. Chechnya is the worst of the worst inside Russia. It is a semi-autonomous republic inside Russia and one of the teams, the Egyptian team, actually has a training camp there. A few months ago, they arrested the last human rights defenders in Chechnya. It is, as I said, a black hole for human rights.

The World Cup is being held all around the world, is Russia special?

I think it is the number and the extent of human rights violations that Russia is involved in. Both domestically, like the ones I have mentioned, but also places like Syria where it is helping the Assad regime.

It’s a lot of money. Wherever there is a lot of money, there is a lot of politics. Billions and billions are spent on this, it is a big, big, show, it is a festival of sports.

How hard is it to maintain some level of human rights in those circumstances?

It is interesting. You would think it is more difficult, but the honest truth is there are companies, businesses around the world that respect human rights to a greater degree than some other companies. FIFA has actually been trying, to some extent, over the last two years, to recognise human rights obligations. So in the last two years, since 2016, they have adopted a new human rights policy, they have put human rights into their statute, they have a human rights manager, they have a human rights advisory board. These are all on the surface, not actions on the ground, but it is a positive step.

They have conducted some inspections of these worksites, but the problem is that we do not have the analyses of these inspections in public, so we do not know exactly what happened. We would like to know, and see what they had found. We have asked, but we are still going back and forth. The initial answer was no, but we are hoping for some more clarity on that.

They all want a successful World Cup, the nations that are playing, the fans, the players, everybody wants a fun, exciting event. And people want to make money. So it is difficult then, sometimes, to bring in some of these other issues that are uncomfortable. It is uncomfortable that Russia has a law on discrimination that goes completely counter to FIFA’s human rights cause. So FIFA says you are not allowed to discriminate on the basis of gender, ethnicity, and sexual orientation. And, of course, Russia has a law, the anti gay population law, that is a clear violation of the idea in the FIFA statute.

Was it a mistake to organise the World Cup in Russia?

Look, all countries have human rights problems, you are not going to somehow find the ideal country where everything is perfect. Was it a mistake? It may not have been my personal choice, but it is also an opportunity for human rights activists. Now that the spotlight is shining on Russia, let us put some of that spotlight on the human rights abuses that are happening. FIFA has some power, and we can put some pressure on Russia.

Did you expect a stronger reaction from some countries, such as Great Britain?

We are calling for the leaders to not attend the opening ceremony. The opening ceremony of the World Cup is a political event, it is the moment where Russia is showcasing itself the most, that is the big PR event. And really, based just on what’s happening, in Syria, and the crimes that Russia is committing with Assad regime, it’s pretty clear that world leaders would be making a mistake to attend this event. I think some Europeans will not go, not just because of Syria, but also other reasons, the Skripal poisoning. Some will not attend.

You have witnessed the 2014 Winter Olympic Games in Sochi, some of the same concerns exist now?

Absolutely. When they were building the venues, a lot of the construction workers were not paid.

Has anything changed?

From Sochi to now, I think no. In fact, I think Russia now is certainly at the worst point in terms of human rights since the Soviet Era. It is the worst it has been.

Is that Putin’s fault?

I do not think you can blame one person, but, obviously in a situation like that, when one man has so much power, he bears a lot of the blame. But it is not ever just one person, it is the people around that leader, the institutions, the individuals. It is not something that happened from the Russian independence to the next day.

My last question for you is, after Russia, we are expecting another World Cup in 2022 in Qatar, what are your expectations from that?

Well, frankly, the Human Rights Watch has a lot of the same worries about Qatar that we have about Russia. Regarding workers’ rights, we are already seeing a lot of problematic things happening on the construction sites, in terms of workers’ rights simply not being respected. That is something that is very troubling.

Follow N1 via mobile apps for Android | iPhone/iPad | Windows| and social media on Twitter | Facebook.